(no subject)
Jan. 21st, 2003 02:10 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
cabbitzillaThis... is likely to be a long and rather rambling post, so I'm going to cut-tag it from the outset.
I... find myself in a curious mood tonight. I've just had the 'priveledge' of skimming another's journal, and found some rather biting assessments of friendship and comraderie there. The experience has left me sad... and a bit concerned.
But before I get into that, there's something else that's on my mind that needs to be dealt with: self help programs. Particularly the 'go off to camp and don't talk about it -ever-' kind of program. Getting help is NOT an excuse for rudeness, brusqueness, or baseless accusations. It is NOT a 'get out of jail free' card for overbearing conversational tactics. It is NOT a Plenary Indulgence for direct personal attacks. Ever.
Who the hell am I to say? I'm a survivor of NA gone terribly, horribly wrong. My privacy was violated and it cost me the job I had at the time, as well as my apartment and my truck. I know who did it... I can even prove it... and that doesn't get me jack. But worse than having the so-called veil ripped away was the -why- of it. You see, I'd gotten myself clean on my own... I entered the NA program hoping to help someone else... and was told that I was 'all wrong'. Wrong? Funny, it sure as hell -worked-. But I dared to question the program, and came to be viewed as a danger; to head off this danger, I was 'narc'd on. Which blew my admittedly very low level security clearance straight out of the water.
It brought to my attention that the reason the programs are so very closely knit is that everyone is different... and if anyone 'questions', then the entire program loses impact for anyone who comes in contact with them. (No, I'm not interested in arguments against my stance. I've been shouted at and mocked for nearly 15 years because I walked a path different from the program... and I'm still clean. My way works just as well.) Unfortunately, this tends to build a barrier between new 'converts' and old friends... the new members are taught early on that 'outsiders' are 'bad'. Maybe not in those words, but there's always something pointing the blame for temptation to whatever just walked through the door, rather than taking responsibility for one's own actions.
Yeah, that's the kicker. So-and-so is to blame; it's so very easy to fall into the trap. I do it myself, even as hard as I try to avoid it. But that layer of mistrust that's cast by those initial teachings can cause a lot of hardship and miscommunications. Friends trying to reach out and be supportive suddenly look like demons intent on holding you back. *sigh* And the harder the friends try, the worse it'll get; the only way out of the cycle is for the person in the program to -REALIZE- what's going on and take steps to fix it.... and sadly, that's a very small percentage. The rest go their merry way, becoming ever more intolerant of everyone else's faults, and blaming those less-than-stellar people for their -own- shortcomings. Sadly, some folks do the very same pattern with religion.
Some manage to wake up in time to prevent the destruction, or at least minimize it... but the rest of the folks need to know that this is a very small amount. From what I've seen, the very best thing that can be done is to wish the person well and step back; don't sever ties completely, but try to get clear of the firefight. If they come back, then it's an added delight. If not... well, you know what the score is. But I've always wondered about programs that claim to 'help you help yourself' by isolating yourself from folks who love you; I don't give a fucking damn WHO is pitching the program, cutting away your safety net in favor of a group you only qualify for by going to ritualistic meetings is foolish.
As for the friends... *sigh* I wish I knew how to help. I know what I put my friends through, and there are precious few who'd still talk to me by the time I got my head screwed back on straight. All I can suggest is that you try to remember who the person was before; that person still exists, and will eventually reappear again. Accusations made in the heat of passion (regardless of the origins of the passion) are the thinnest kind. Particularly if they're the kind that lash out at everyone, applying labels like 'manipulative' and 'controlling'; such are the rantings of a mind desperate to find someone to blame for the mess it's in other than itself. It's a mindset we all end up in sooner or later; acknowledgement of which does -not- condone it or make it any less reprehensible.
Growth isn't prompted by joy and happiness; those emotions tend to be sedentary and resistant to change or progress. No, sadly, it's pain that provides an impetus for growth; a reason to be other than you are. Baggage is, simply put, the heralds and hallmarks of the lessons each of us have learned thus far; everyone has it, and denying it or attempting to wish it away is no more useful than trying to pee 'up' in a gravity well. And that is most certainly that.
'Honesty' is often used as a shield by those who would build themselves up by tearing others down, using it to leverage in cutting statements and callous remarks. Such people make excellent lawyers. Unfortunately, (for them or for me, depending on your viewpoint) I believe that all such people should be shot. Harsh? Yes, it is. But I'm tired of seeing good people cut to shreds because some twit wants to win a 'biggest dick' contest.
And on that note, I believe I'm going to go to bed. I've said as much of my piece as I can tonight, and will yield the soapbox to the next lunatic preacher in line.
*hugs*
~Ellie-chan
I... find myself in a curious mood tonight. I've just had the 'priveledge' of skimming another's journal, and found some rather biting assessments of friendship and comraderie there. The experience has left me sad... and a bit concerned.
But before I get into that, there's something else that's on my mind that needs to be dealt with: self help programs. Particularly the 'go off to camp and don't talk about it -ever-' kind of program. Getting help is NOT an excuse for rudeness, brusqueness, or baseless accusations. It is NOT a 'get out of jail free' card for overbearing conversational tactics. It is NOT a Plenary Indulgence for direct personal attacks. Ever.
Who the hell am I to say? I'm a survivor of NA gone terribly, horribly wrong. My privacy was violated and it cost me the job I had at the time, as well as my apartment and my truck. I know who did it... I can even prove it... and that doesn't get me jack. But worse than having the so-called veil ripped away was the -why- of it. You see, I'd gotten myself clean on my own... I entered the NA program hoping to help someone else... and was told that I was 'all wrong'. Wrong? Funny, it sure as hell -worked-. But I dared to question the program, and came to be viewed as a danger; to head off this danger, I was 'narc'd on. Which blew my admittedly very low level security clearance straight out of the water.
It brought to my attention that the reason the programs are so very closely knit is that everyone is different... and if anyone 'questions', then the entire program loses impact for anyone who comes in contact with them. (No, I'm not interested in arguments against my stance. I've been shouted at and mocked for nearly 15 years because I walked a path different from the program... and I'm still clean. My way works just as well.) Unfortunately, this tends to build a barrier between new 'converts' and old friends... the new members are taught early on that 'outsiders' are 'bad'. Maybe not in those words, but there's always something pointing the blame for temptation to whatever just walked through the door, rather than taking responsibility for one's own actions.
Yeah, that's the kicker. So-and-so is to blame; it's so very easy to fall into the trap. I do it myself, even as hard as I try to avoid it. But that layer of mistrust that's cast by those initial teachings can cause a lot of hardship and miscommunications. Friends trying to reach out and be supportive suddenly look like demons intent on holding you back. *sigh* And the harder the friends try, the worse it'll get; the only way out of the cycle is for the person in the program to -REALIZE- what's going on and take steps to fix it.... and sadly, that's a very small percentage. The rest go their merry way, becoming ever more intolerant of everyone else's faults, and blaming those less-than-stellar people for their -own- shortcomings. Sadly, some folks do the very same pattern with religion.
Some manage to wake up in time to prevent the destruction, or at least minimize it... but the rest of the folks need to know that this is a very small amount. From what I've seen, the very best thing that can be done is to wish the person well and step back; don't sever ties completely, but try to get clear of the firefight. If they come back, then it's an added delight. If not... well, you know what the score is. But I've always wondered about programs that claim to 'help you help yourself' by isolating yourself from folks who love you; I don't give a fucking damn WHO is pitching the program, cutting away your safety net in favor of a group you only qualify for by going to ritualistic meetings is foolish.
As for the friends... *sigh* I wish I knew how to help. I know what I put my friends through, and there are precious few who'd still talk to me by the time I got my head screwed back on straight. All I can suggest is that you try to remember who the person was before; that person still exists, and will eventually reappear again. Accusations made in the heat of passion (regardless of the origins of the passion) are the thinnest kind. Particularly if they're the kind that lash out at everyone, applying labels like 'manipulative' and 'controlling'; such are the rantings of a mind desperate to find someone to blame for the mess it's in other than itself. It's a mindset we all end up in sooner or later; acknowledgement of which does -not- condone it or make it any less reprehensible.
Growth isn't prompted by joy and happiness; those emotions tend to be sedentary and resistant to change or progress. No, sadly, it's pain that provides an impetus for growth; a reason to be other than you are. Baggage is, simply put, the heralds and hallmarks of the lessons each of us have learned thus far; everyone has it, and denying it or attempting to wish it away is no more useful than trying to pee 'up' in a gravity well. And that is most certainly that.
'Honesty' is often used as a shield by those who would build themselves up by tearing others down, using it to leverage in cutting statements and callous remarks. Such people make excellent lawyers. Unfortunately, (for them or for me, depending on your viewpoint) I believe that all such people should be shot. Harsh? Yes, it is. But I'm tired of seeing good people cut to shreds because some twit wants to win a 'biggest dick' contest.
And on that note, I believe I'm going to go to bed. I've said as much of my piece as I can tonight, and will yield the soapbox to the next lunatic preacher in line.
*hugs*
~Ellie-chan
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no subject
Date: 2003-01-20 11:17 pm (UTC)*hugs*
Date: 2003-01-21 03:37 am (UTC)More have noticed that...
Date: 2003-01-21 12:25 pm (UTC)AlaTeen and has cultivated this whole 'you just wouldn't understand' thing thanks to them, which hurts
because I would understand what it's like being raised by an addict. This same friend had a
horrifically bad relationship with another from his AlaTeen group that he wouldn't listen to anyone
about because of the same wall that was instilled.
*hugs*
-Vulpin